Important Publishing Info

[twyrch]

The following is a Post by an author named Micheal J. Allen. His current project was called "Children of the Shadows".

I don't know if anyone here has dabbled in writing and trying to be published, but Micheal has some very good advice concerning the process.

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Good day everyone. As you may recall on numerous threads about publishers I have made comments about the importance of taking care which publisher you sign with. I have also refered to the use of a publishing contract lawyer to help you watch out for nonstandard contracts or even better an Agent to ensure that you get a reputible publisher and the best contract.

Well, it is now official. I am no longer a published novelist. I still have other publishing credits mind you and two other books/series I am trying to get published. But the publisher of Children of the Shadow, when they discovered that I would not be ordering a large number of books from them (a thousand) opted to out my contract.

Because of the loss of contact all changes that 2Cents Editing and I did to my manuscript during the publishing contract term are lost as a some publishing contracts claim all edits performed during the contract as belonging to the publisher. I must go back to my copyrighted manuscript (See, I told you spending $30 with the Library of Congress was worth it) and rebuild from there. Two years of fine tooth comb edits, content improvements, scene expansions, gone. All the work designing a pretty cover and then letting an artist make the design real, gone.

I am restricted in what I can say about my former publisher by nondefamation and confidentiality clauses so I would like to be on record that nothing I am about to say has anything whatsoever to do with that publisher, but rather the things I have learned in the publishing industry:

Definition: Defame: To damage the reputation, character, or good name of by slander or libel.
Definition: Libel: A false publication, as in writing, print, signs, or pictures, that damages a person's reputation
Definition: Slander:Oral communication of false statements injurious to a person's reputation

(I guess that would mean technically that defamation is speaking falshoods to hurt someones reputation and doesn't apply to facts.)

Some publishers I have learned about from other authors, such as Publish America, charge deposits for "author cooperation" This is nonstandard and will get the publisher black listed with organizations such as the Science Fiction and Fantasy Writers Association (There are warnings about various publishers at (http://www.sfwa.org)

Some publisher will charge nonstandard rates for list price and expect the author to buy large print runs for "signing distribution" and "review copies" - The author will need to do some of this, but a thousand is a bit more than the norm...a bit.

Trivia: Did you know the offical list price on Children of the Shadow was $22 for a paperback?

Some publishers will treat your novel as if it were a non-fiction work with requirements based on the non-fiction and lecture tour market, not making allowances for the difference in the book marketing needed to make a novel successful.

Some publishers are all about making their profit off of the author, not the reader.

Thus I would like to caution you once again. Please, take care what publisher you choose. Use a reputable agent (they don't charge up front either) for finding you a good publisher and getting you a good contract. Or use a Publishing lawyer, not just a contract lawyer as I did, to check your contract.

I realize many of you have been waiting a long time for Children of the Shadow, and I am as sorry as you are that after two years in the publishing process we still don't have a book. I appreciate everyone's support, I am trying to figure out a way to make it up to everyone. I am terribly sorry to have to make this announcement and disappoint everyone. I apologize for letting you down.

To close on a happy note, however. Children of the Shadow has already begun the rebuild process. I had the foresight to get a derivation copyright within the contact period and thus own outright some of the changes 2 Cents and I made...so we are not totally back to square one. 2 Cents Editing resupplied all of their edits and suggestions, so getting them worked back in will not take too long. The new rewrites to Children of the Shadow so far are excellent, improving it by leaps and bounds, because as you know you get better with every page you write, and I have written a lot of pages since this one was completed. So the new book will be better than ever.

I have found a literary agency that can handle all of the new books (varied genres) ready to go to publish, and will be offering them Children of the Shadow as soon as it is ready to go again (after another derivation copyright) - Micheal J. Allen

[twyrch]

In addition to Micheal's comments I thought I would post a message written by A.C. Crispin Author of The Rebel Dawn, Voices of Chaos, ect... Although her message is completely against what most writers suggest and what publishers would have you believe, it certainly makes you think. Please keep in mind the article was written some time back and does not easily apply to modern times.

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Some time ago I did a book signing in a mall, and the strangest thing happened. I was sitting there with books heaped around me, and a man approached me and stood there looking diffident. I smiled at him and said, "Hi." This person was in his early 40's, perhaps, well-dressed, well-spoken, with his young son in tow. The kid grabbed a copy of Rebel Dawn, my newest Star Wars novel, and said, "Look Dad, Star Wars! Can I have it?" After the book was signed to the boy, the man cleared his throat. "I'm really interested in writing, too." After hundreds of book signings over the past 14 years, this is hardly a new comment. I smiled and nodded. "I … well, I have a couple of publishers who are very interested in publishing my book," the man continued. "So, I, uh … well, I wondered. Would you mind if I ask you how much it cost you to have these books published?"

If I hadn't been spending the last few months helping out Literaryscams, I would have been surprised and horrified by his question. Instead, I handed him a copy of Rebel Dawn. "How much do you think it cost me to publish that book?" I asked. He hefted the book, riffled the pages. "Well, it's pretty long," he said. "Longer than mine. Uh … eight thousand dollars?" I gestured at the books in front of me. "What would you say if I told you that this publisher -- Bantam -- paid me to write these books? About twenty thousand dollars apiece. And I'll most likely earn royalties above and beyond that." The man could not have appeared more thunderstruck if I'd leaped up on my chair and done my Roseanne Barr imitation. "They paid you?"

"Yes, they did," I said. I waved at the books surrounding us in the bookstore. "All these authors got paid to write these books. Did you really think they all paid to get published?" He blinked. "Well, I knew they probably paid Stephen King and Grisham," he muttered. "But the rest … the new writers … " "Sir," I said, "money is supposed to come from the publisher to the author. Not the other way around. Not ever, unless you're wanting to publish something extremely specialized, like your family history, or a volume of your poetry or something. Writers are supposed to get paid for writing commercial books." Minutes later, I sent the gentleman on his way, armed with the Literaryscams URL, and an earnest entreaty to look up the page. I also cautioned him not to send his work to any publisher whose books he couldn't find in the average general-purpose bookstore.

This incident brought home to me how much harm the scam agents and publishers are doing to the once proud tradition of publishing. I realize that most of you who are reading this have done your research and know the pitfalls. But for those who are new to writing, I offer the following guidelines. Feel free to copy them and pass them along. If you follow them, you are unlikely to be rooked:

1. If an agent charges a fee, they are highly suspect. I don't care what they call it: reading fee, processing fee, contract fee, whatever … any kind of fee is bad. If an agent charges more than $50.00, I suggest you run away. Agents who charge fees in the hundreds of dollars make their money off charging writers, not by selling their manuscripts to publishers. It's very likely that after you pay the large fee, the agent will never even submit your manuscript to a real publisher.

2. If an agent refers you to a "book doctor" be very wary. Any agent that says your ms. needs editing should provide you with a list of a number of independent editors, and then allow you to pick the one you want to use. There should be NO financial connection whatsoever between the agent and the independent editor.

3. If an agent refers you to a co-op or subsidy press, run away. No reputable agent will do that.

4. If an agent you've never heard of solicits your work, that's not a good sign. Real literary agents have to fight off clients, not go out looking for them. If an agent advertises via direct mail, the internet, or in writers' magazines, back off!

5. If an agent has an office in some out-of-the-way place like Bumpass, West Virginia, be very suspicious. Most real agents operate out of New York or California. There are exceptions, particularly on the East Coast; but if Agent X from Bent Fork North Dakota writes to you and begs to see your ms., chances are excellent he's a crook. Be smart!

6. Any reputable agent should be willing to provide you with a list of sales and clients. Go to a bookstore and verify that these books and authors exist. Check references. If an agent claims to be an AAR (Association of Authors Representatives) member, go to the AAR site and look him/her up. Fake agents have lied about this before.

7. If an agent tells you you're brilliant, and your book is sure to be a bestseller, be wary. Real agents don't make statements like that -- at least not to unknown authors.

8. Never pay a vanity press or subsidy publisher to publish your book. This includes "co-op" publishers. If you must get your book published and have exhausted all professional, commercial avenues, check into self-publishing with a reputable printing company. Many poets, for example, self-publish their books. Your money will go a lot further that way. Go to your local bookstore and get a book on self-publishing. Check a printer's references before you sign any contracts. You will not receive the distribution and other services normally expected of a publisher, but you will get the books -- after they are printed they will be shipped to you. Be aware that most bookstores will not stock self-published books.

9. Having a poor agent is frequently worse than having no agent at all. If you can't find a reputable agent to submit your manuscript, go ahead and submit it yourself. Most sf and fantasy publishers will still read unagented manuscripts these days. Check out the market reports in the SFWA Bulletin or Speculations. Even the ones who say they won't may still read manuscripts from writers who impress them with a well-crafted, dynamic query letter.

So, to all you prospective writers out there … Never forget. If you're paying anyone to agent, publish, or edit your work, the money's going in the wrong direction, and, quite likely, you've fallen for a scam. You will end up losing money and gaining nothing. You deserve to be paid for your work! Becoming a writer is difficult, and requires a great deal of perseverance. As James Gunn once said, "Anyone who can be discouraged from becoming a writer should be discouraged." In other words, hang in there and don't expect a bed of roses. But people do "break in" every day, and that's the good news!

- A.C. Crispin

[twyrch]

I thought I would post a few more comments from people who have been through the publishing process and know the ropes. Enjoy!!

You can't write a book without a knowledge of the publishing process. I highly suggest that you go to a library and research the publishing process. If you don't want to do that, the internet offers a great many resources.

www.soyouwanna.com/site/syws/publishbook/publishbook.html

eserver.org/books/how2publish/

This site is especially good:
hollylisle.com/fm/Articles/faqs2.html

[twyrch]

you need not copyright before you send it in to a publisher in the US your work is protected the moment you write it. Since your work is finsihed, edit and then edit and then do some editing and then do a bunch of reading.

Generally, you need to look into houses that publish the kind of work you have written. Check Writer's Market for this. Make note of the names of the editors at various houses that you are interested in. Addressing them when you send them somethign rather than addressing it to Editor or To Whom it May Concern is important.

Go to the web site of or snail mail the house you wish to get publishing guidelines for and read them over several times. Be sure th ehouse does indeed accept your type of work and then be sure it is in the format they want. Also be sure your submission is properly put together. Many houses want a synopsis and 3 chapters others want the whole manuscript.

Be aware that some houses - notably Del Rey TB's publisher - do NOT take unsolicited aka unagented work. If they say this they MEAN it. No agent means they won;t even look at it. If you are h*ll bent ona house that requires an agent you will be lookign up agents and sending your work to them to read and if they like ti they will offer it to a house. If not you will be sneding the work to the publisher by yourself.

If it is then accepted I reccommend you then send a proposal to an agent along the lines of 'TOR books offered me a contract for my book, would you like to represent me?' You will probably have an easier time getting an agent this way, but a harder time selling the book in the first place.

In any event if you can;t get an agent get a good laywer who knows contract law to look things over.....

[twyrch]

Publishing is such a bear to tackle!! I suggest to both of you that have finished the book to look into the publishing business before you ever send anything off. There are so many great sources for you to follow.

Writer's Market is wonderful. They just published their 2005 edition. It has LOADS of info. Also it gives criteria for all the houses and what they are looking for.

To send it off-find the name of the person you are looking for--don't just send to whom may concern! Also every House and agent is looking for something different. Some say they want letters-then if they like the sound of the query they want the first 3 chaps-then if they like that then the whole ms--but this still does not mean they accept you.

Make sure it is in the VERY BEST form it can possibly be in--they are not looking at your work to correct mistakes-but to buy a new best seller!

Writer's Market gives you all this info--I personally have the 2004 edition and am a member of the on-line, on-line has more info and is more current b/c the Houses update often and the book is published once a year-criteria changes.

I personally hired an editor to help me with my ms. I have written a book-and am just finishing up my second. My editor is WONDERFUL--has has improved my manuscript(ms) by leaps and bounds.

If you want to copyrite it you can-I didn't. If you go to the Library of Congress website they give you all the info you need. It is only like $35 to do so-but if you get into a House they will automatically have it copyrited. Also they give you all the info incase you don't copy it--personally I have not copied mine-but that was just personal choice. If you do it then change anything then it has to be re-copied-and that is more expensive.

I highly suggest looking into all of it before you do anything. Learn everything you can-talk to people-go to conventions(this is one of the best ways to become known and talk to agents-authors-publishers etc...) Know the business before you become tangled into it.

In the end it will pay off

[twyrch]

Editing is the most important part of the pre-submission process. A professional editor can give your manuscript a profession gleam.

Choosing a publisher is the second. When I started this process almost 3 years ago now I knew very little. But as the old phrase goes, if I only knew then what I know now. That being the case to avoid the problems and waste of time I am incurring, I highly recommend you go with an agent. They will be able to choose the best and most importantly reputable publishers. They also know the publishing contract standards and will be able to get you a better deal.

Since I am soon to be just one of you again, not that I was/am anything special as far as I am concerned, I will be placing my formerly about to release novel into the hands of an agent as soon as the contracts are all worked out, along with its sequel and another series starter. Sure you may pay a little bit of royalty in comission, but they can get you higher contract rates and into doors you would otherwise never be able to penetrate.

I appreciate the praise Kinsonravenlock and the thanks Jesterr, but I would like to restate that I am no different than any one of you. As for a release date, well I am embroiled in a major argument with my publisher which may end up turning into a cancelled contract and a search for a new publisher...this time with a literary agent...I've learned my lesson.

For those who are writing and want to go to publish, find yourself a professional editor, preferably one who edits for your genre. It can make all the difference in the world. Oh and for those of you who do end up going with Mike and the gang at 2 Cents Editing, if you give them too much work to do I am on the list of alternate editors...so you may have to deal with me *evil laughter*

2 Cents Editing is listed on my website contacts page, but I will also supply the email address. They do a great job, 2 cents a word, 2 passes (different that most) over the manuscript. they also have a rate for content editing, which I use. They have a really great collective mind for helping with content improvements.

[e-mail] [Editor at 2Cents Publishing]

- Michael J. Allen

[Child of Immanuel]

Twrch, just tell me when your book is going to come out. By hook or by crook (lol), I will buy a copy.

Then I'll grill you. **evil cackle**

[twyrch]

Child said:

Twrch, just tell me when your book is going to come out. By hook or by crook (lol), I will buy a copy.

Then I'll grill you. **evil cackle**

LOL! You've got yourself a deal. ;D I really ought to be working on it instead of posting here... but that's one of my biggest problems. Chatting instead of working...

Well, back to Chapter 15!